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Advanced Warning about Mac OS X 10.9 Mavericks


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#1 waves

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Posted 10 October 2013 - 05:29 PM

As Apple has seeded the Golden Master of Mac OS X 10.9 Mavericks keep in mind before "updating" some ports will no longer work.

So before "updating" your Macintosh's OS, make sure to remember your favourite Game or Application may no longer work.

Every time there is an update to Mac OS X we will lose some compatibility - or in the frustrating case of 10.7.5 and 10.8.2 things broke on point updates.

What will not work for sure:

Chromium Ports - these broke with Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard. So they only work with 10.4 Tiger and 10.5 Leopard (Intel). There are a few still kicking around.

CXZ/CXS/CXE Ports - Basically broke with Mac OS X 10.7 Lion - These work on 10.4-10.6 only. A few games however, and all Application ports will work on 10.7.

Old Wineskin Ports.

Some Cider Ports may no longer work.

What will work:

Wineskin 2.5x with Wineskin Engines WS8+ will continue to work on Mac OS X 10.6 / 10.7 / 10.8 / 10.9
* For Mac OS X 10.5 Leopard - this engine with work with Wineskin 2.5x - http://cl.ly/3n1O3N2E2z37 (courtesy thedoctor45)

Most Cider ports.

Dosbox Ports

ScummVM Ports

*It should also be noted that your Favourite game or Application that is Mac Native may no longer work when "updating" so keep that in mind as well.

See this guide for updating an older port to run on Mac OS X 10.9 Mavericks: http://portingteam.c...-os-updates-r22

Cheers.
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#2 Reboot

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Posted 11 October 2013 - 01:09 AM

Why not on front page? :(

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#3 waves

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Posted 19 October 2013 - 06:24 PM

View PostREBOOT, on 11 October 2013 - 01:09 AM, said:

Why not on front page? :(

We need some announcements ;)

I will put it up Tuesday.
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#4 Kama.Stein

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Posted 21 October 2013 - 03:10 AM

Sounds like the same sort of compatibility that one might experience in even Mountain Lion. I'd say so long as you keep your native and wrapped games up to date and running in Mountain Lion you probably shouldn't run into many problems in 10.9. I've moved most of my Cider ports to Wineskin here and kept them up to date.

People going from 10.6 to 10.9 might run into troubles though especially if they haven't kept their stuff up to date. Some people thought their PowerPC games would last forever and that was not the case.
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#5 waves

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Posted 23 October 2013 - 09:41 PM

View PostTetsu, on 21 October 2013 - 03:10 AM, said:

People going from 10.6 to 10.9 might run into troubles though especially if they haven't kept their stuff up to date.

This is the main reason - I am sticking on Mac OS X 10.6.8. Too much stuff of mine would break. Mac OS X Lion, left 95% of the CX based ports with just a single 'hop' in the Dock and nothing more. A pretty big blow to me, and the site as a whole in my opinion. Not as a knock to doh123 and Wineskin however. It is just if they were already made, changing them over can (sometimes) be a hassle.

View PostTetsu, on 21 October 2013 - 03:10 AM, said:

Some people thought their PowerPC games would last forever and that was not the case.

I may be in a minority, but that would have been nice. :)
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#6 Kama.Stein

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Posted 23 October 2013 - 10:16 PM

That's a shame too because in order to stick to all that old stuff you have to then miss out on a lot of other new stuff. You can't move forward by standing still and clinging to the past.

Also, I'm glad to have switched some of my older games that don't work on newer versions of OS X (PowerPC) and where never updated to wrapped versions and kept them on as high a wrapper as they can run on. That's saved me from being one of those whinging people who where lamenting the loss of rosetta.
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#7 thedoc

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 02:22 AM

it's just Apple policy to dump old stuff as quickly as possible - killing backwards compatibility in the process and making it hard to develop for older OS releases. I suppose it makes life easier for them cause it saves them and other devs the trouble of having to deal with a userbase that clings to outdated software. It's a subtle way of forcing us to stay up-to-date, making us indirectly accept anything new that they decide to throw at us and that i do not like. One should always be given a choice imho (some people actually have good reasons for sticking with older software) I myself would be running 10.6.8 if it wasn't for this annoying icon bug that Apple obviously doesn't care about fixing - but hey you can always just buy the latest system upgrade right?
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#8 Kama.Stein

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 02:47 AM

Yup, I paid a whole 0 dollars for that latest system upgrade. I'm pretty sure if I don't like it I can get a refund!

I think I know what you are referring to when you are talking about icon bug though. The bug where icons would get corrupted and show blurry pixelated low res right? I was having this bug for the longest time... Even in 10.7 10.8 I'd get it sometimes.. particularly in Candybar... doesn't seem to happen in 10.9 though. I spent a lot of time going through icons in candybar (which btw, is slowly breaking since the authors aren't bothering to update it)... and I haven't run into the bug I'm talking about yet.
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It's funny how the colors of the real world only seem really real when you viddy them on the screen.
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#9 thedoc

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 03:13 AM

Yea that's the one - it's a pretty common problem I suppose - must be some kind of corruption in the systems icon cache that manifests itself after a certain time - if you don't counteract it everything will become a blurry mess which in some cases even affects usability of the entire OS - I once put together a little app that cleans out the cache during system runtime and then restarts dock and finder, but that's a temporary solution at best. I really wish this would just be fixed and I might not be as pissed off at Apple as I am today.
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#10 waves

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 05:26 AM

Doc I agree with you. The icon bug has been reported a million times - never fixed. In 10.6 and 10.7 - not sure about 10.8 and 10.9.

Oddly enough I had ran Snow Leo for over a year and I never experienced it. Then did a system restore and about two weeks after that, the icon bug just appeared....but after 3 fresh install it went away.

My main issue is killing backwards compatibility. I was listening to 1 episode of the Hypercritical podcast - they made a good point - hire like 5 really smart guys that all they do is focus on officially emulating old software. I mean supporting old games and apps would be great. Rather than almost forcing you to update to get new features. ie iMessage. Beta in 10.7 but then taken a way when it hit version 1.0 - only to be including as a "new" feature in 10.8.

Have these same guys emulate System 7 - I mean there is not practical use. But just for nostalgia and then when your bored with it after 15 minutes you can just move on.

I would pay some money to be able to do it to. There is money to be made in old software, see people paying 7 bucks (or whatever) for the original Mario to be able to pay on the Wii. I have a CX port of Classic Mac - just so I can play  Deliverance: Stormlord 2 and Bard's Tale ;)

I mean you have 100 billion dollars in cash in the bank, I am sure you can afford it.

On a side note - Apple killed Applescript in iWork 13. Why? Who knows. Damning news. Source: http://fireballed.or...rk-applescript/
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#11 Kama.Stein

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 05:29 AM

I should have said 10.8 (fixed my above post)... my icon bug that I mentioned also happened to me in 10.8 with Candybar... but not 10.9 so far. I'll let you know if it ever happens to me again. The only thing I could do in 10.8 was restart candybar until the problem vanished... although that was not really a solution per say.

As far as backwards compatibility goes I think they should make the best of all the older games available in OS X officially. Something that we ourselves are doing a pretty good job of right here. Source ports can also be good.. someone was working on a port of the Mac Wolfenstein: http://www.youtube.c...h?v=PId-3Q_PC94 (I have a version of a Mac Wolfenstein running with the mac native version of EDGE.. but haven't tried this one)....

Face it, some of those older PowerPC games that where broken in OS updates where not the best versions of the game anyway like for example.. Unreal 1 and UT.. I never got the music or detail textures to work with those... those ports had been pretty much abandoned for years unlike the Windows versions which where constantly being upgraded albeit unofficially. Even if rosetta where still around I'd still rather play those wrapped than stick to those old versions.
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#12 thedoc

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 04:53 PM

I've ported most of my favourite OS9/PPC games to Intel OSX myself - Unreal and original UT for example work great in Cider with Hi-Res textures and Direct3D 9 renderer - using ENBseries you can even get Shader 2.0 effects like bloom and bumpmapping enabled which adds greatly to the games atmosphere, but seeing as the guys at GOG.com now use Wineskin wrappers do port old classic games to OSX us retro gamers might find ourselves without a job sooner or later lol.
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#13 Kama.Stein

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Posted 24 October 2013 - 11:13 PM

I like those in Wineskin instead because I can load up OpenAL Soft and get true 5.1 surround sound with my rig. :) Again, something that cider is incapable of. Transgaming never did the sound code refactoring that WineHQ\Codeweavers did from what I can tell. So I'd rather avoid Cider if at all possible.
But yeah, I've got mine ported with high res textures and graphics mods too..

However, I've always had issues with enbseries in one way or another so for feature injection I use stuff like "FXAA Injection Tool" or "SweetFX" instead (and configuring the nessasary DX9 dll's (namely d3dx9_43 and d3dcompiler_43) so they'll function. They can inject antialiasing, bloom, HDR, film grain type noise, tone mapping, etc. the features I use depend on what the game has and whether they improve it or not....

For DX8 games I do use the ENB DX8 to 9 converter first and then the utilities I mention. Didn't have much luck with any tool that injects FXAA with Cider though... it always malfunctioned and did the inverse to the antialiasing. Making the entire scene blurry instead of antialiased...

For OpenGL games I use QeffectsGL... a similar injection dll to add effects to older OpenGL games... that is of course unless they have their own specific mods such as sikkmod for Doom 3. But for example Quake 3 engine games look great with QeffectsGL and tastefully done settings.

Examples..

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#14 thedoc

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 04:38 AM

that does look nice - I might give QeffectsGL a try.
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#15 Kama.Stein

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 04:46 AM

In both I have bloom, color correction, screen space ambient occlusion and antialiasing (8xMSAA which is the highest it let me go) on and a few texture mods.. particularly on the Alice shot. I ended up using some of the textures from Omri Koresh's alice texture update but removing some because it was causing crashes with the game and instead used some of the texture updates from the American McGee rerelease that game with Alice Madness Returns instead. I keep most of the other stuff because it's updates to the UI, loading screens, etc. which look signifigantly better than the old stock..

http://omrikoresh.de...-PACK-312237286

I looked into the pk files and saw which ones had the skins and replaced them with the pk*_mod files from the reissue in Alice Madness Returns. This mod is suposed to let one get said textures without having to buy Alice Madness Returns...

http://www.moddb.com...-madly-enhanced

But yeah with a little bit of "elbow grease" you should be able to mod your American McGee's Alice like mine.
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#16 thedoc

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 05:03 AM

Would you mind sharing your QeffectsGL.ini config file settings for Q3 engine based titles?
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#17 waves

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 05:18 PM

View Postthedoc, on 25 October 2013 - 05:03 AM, said:

Would you mind sharing your QeffectsGL.ini config file settings for Q3 engine based titles?

I second that request.
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#18 Kama.Stein

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Posted 25 October 2013 - 10:49 PM

Here's what I have for star trek voyager elite force:

[Generic]
Anisotropy=16
Multisample=8
MultisampleHint=0
Bloom=1.2
BloomSteps=12
BloomDarken=2
BloomScale=1.5
SSAO=1
SSAOScale=0.40
SSAOMinZ=0.005
SSAOMaxZ=1.0
Hue=0
Saturation=-5
Lightness=-5
Emboss=1
EmbossScale=0.1
DOF=1
DOFMinZ=0.005
DOFSpeed=0.75
DOFScale=3.0
Ztrickfix=1

Here's my Alice:

[Generic]
Anisotropy=16
Multisample=8
MultisampleHint=0
Bloom=4
BloomSteps=4.11
BloomDarken=2.5
BloomScale=1
SSAO=1
SSAOScale=0.19
SSAOMinZ=0.005
SSAOMaxZ=1.0
Hue=0
Saturation=-5
Lightness=-3
Emboss=0
EmbossScale=0.8
DOF=0
DOFMinZ=0.05
DOFSpeed=0.5
DOFScale=10
Ztrickfix=0

--Kama
It's funny how the colors of the real world only seem really real when you viddy them on the screen.
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#19 Kama.Stein

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Posted 26 October 2013 - 01:38 AM

Also a quick note.. if you are loading QeffectsGL in Wineskin you have to do a dll override for OpenGL32. If you do it via the Wine Config program It'll warn you that it's not a good idea.. disregard that... it works fine anyway. Or you can just edit the registry directly and bypass that warning entirely. :)
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#20 GothGamer

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Posted 29 October 2013 - 01:36 AM

Can you please please help me! I downloaded American Mcgee's Alice, and I got wineskin winery but it says; "The document “American-McGee's-Alice-(MAC-OS-X).rar” could not be opened. Wineskin Winery cannot open files of this type" So what am I supposed to do? Did I get the wrong version of wineskin winery or did I download the wrong game in general. I don't know, it's all confusing to me since their are a million different versions of wineskin. O.O

#21 Reboot

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Posted 29 October 2013 - 01:44 AM

rar... you need archive extractor tool to extract that rar file.

Try this http://www.kekaosx.com/en/

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#22 Kama.Stein

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Posted 29 October 2013 - 07:00 AM

View PostGothGamer, on 29 October 2013 - 01:36 AM, said:

Can you please please help me! I downloaded American Mcgee's Alice, and I got wineskin winery but it says; "The document “American-McGee's-Alice-(MAC-OS-X).rar” could not be opened. Wineskin Winery cannot open files of this type" So what am I supposed to do? Did I get the wrong version of wineskin winery or did I download the wrong game in general. I don't know, it's all confusing to me since their are a million different versions of wineskin. O.O
Seems to me the latter happened (you got the wrong game in general). The name of the rar file indicates you probably also got the Mac specific version which can't work in Wineskin because it's a native Mac app. That version also doesn't work well in Lion or above which is why I stopped using it and started using a wrapper instead. You need to get the Windows version of American McGee's Alice to run in Wine.
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#23 GothGamer

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Posted 29 October 2013 - 07:23 AM

Ok, thank you both! you've been helpful for sure. I tried what REBOOT said and i got keka and followed it's instructions, and when I got to the part where I was going to actually install Alice, it says; "You can't open the application Alice Installer because PowerPC applications are no longer supported." So, I came across this video: http://www.youtube.c...fkrS5V3PGc  and I followed his instructions of going to the terminal and I typed everything in and entered my password, and I get the message; "sudo: installer-package: command not found" every time I try it. tomorrow I will download the windows version like you said Tetsu, and I hope that what you suggested works, but it seems as though this is a problem for everyone. But I will not give up! XD I've already been through hell trying to figure this out and you guys have got me a couple steps closer, (I hope) so thanks for your replies! ^.^

#24 Kama.Stein

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Posted 29 October 2013 - 08:09 PM

Yeah, the old Mac version needed also needed a  universal binary (intel support) patch to run on modern Mac OS since the game was originally made for PowerPC Macs. However, like I said.. in 10.7 it broke (one had to turn off GL extensions in order to get it running again)... I tried that and i noticed missing effects\glitches. Aspyr had never gotten around to patching it again either.

I recently installed an old game that had a UB patch that makes it run on intel by installing it first on an old PowerPC Mac I have and then patching it and transferring the files over to my current iMac. But for Alice that's not as worth it due to the issues I noted above. If Aspyr got around to patching it they'd probably re-release it on the Mac App Store as well.

I ended up playing Alice Madness Returns in Parallels by the way. That's the way that worked best for me without having to reboot to Windows for that particular game.... I love the art in that game! The controls where better in the first game though.

Feel free to personal message me if you continue to have problems...
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It's funny how the colors of the real world only seem really real when you viddy them on the screen.
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#25 silentarts

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Posted 11 November 2013 - 08:36 PM

OMG! Why did I have to update to Mavericks? Damn....Saw the free sign and got trigger happy...crud :(

#26 Ωmega

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Posted 12 November 2013 - 09:30 AM

View Postsilentarts, on 11 November 2013 - 08:36 PM, said:

OMG! Why did I have to update to Mavericks? Damn....Saw the free sign and got trigger happy...crud :(

I usually don't update my computer unless it's completely necessary. Be careful! ^_^
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#27 ghostmatrix101

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Posted 16 November 2013 - 10:43 PM

I've updated my mac to Mavericks, It works great all my wrappers are in working order. My only gripe is one of my Native games such as NOVA 2 (Possibly others) from the App Store cannot be run any more...

The upgrade is worth it yes, but make sure all your apps support 10.9!
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#28 chrisangel

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Posted 18 November 2013 - 04:53 PM

People seem to have issues with Skyrim and a few other Cider ports.

Why would you buy a game from the App Store? Support the developers and buy directly from them, so Apple does not take a huge cut. Though I suppose, they would rather you buy it through the App Store, then not at all.

#29 syao

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 03:28 PM

View Postthedoc, on 24 October 2013 - 03:13 AM, said:

Yea that's the one - it's a pretty common problem I suppose - must be some kind of corruption in the systems icon cache that manifests itself after a certain time - if you don't counteract it everything will become a blurry mess which in some cases even affects usability of the entire OS - I once put together a little app that cleans out the cache during system runtime and then restarts dock and finder, but that's a temporary solution at best. I really wish this would just be fixed and I might not be as pissed off at Apple as I am today.

Upgraded to Mavericks the day it came out, and I have yet to see the issue.  I had it annoyingly often ever since I upgraded my Tiger to Snow Leopard.  I wonder if it's gone for good now, or I have just been lucky for a month and didn't see it yet.

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#30 dankoB

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Posted 24 November 2013 - 12:11 PM

I've been running Snow Leopard for the last 4 years and I have never once come across this bug. I also don't use CandyBar though. I spent the last few days fooling around with 10.8.5 and 10.9...I didn't try Lion but I'm guessing it's similar ML in may respects. I'm not really a fan of Mavericks. Not sure why. The OS just didn't seem to flow all that great. Nice features but I think I'm gonna stick with 10.6.8 or awhile longer.




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